My DCC Journey

Tallpaul70
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Re: My DCC Journey

#11

Post by Tallpaul70 » Tue Mar 19, 2019 7:31 pm

Hi All,
Re Point control, with over 40 points, I will need some sort of system, counting will not work, although I accept it would be fine on up to maybe 10 points!
Otherwise:-
Collected three chipped locos today. They are a Hornby 08, a Bachmann Pannier and a Hornby Castle. All are fitted with Zimo non sound chips.

These locos were chosen to explore facets of DCC:-
The Castle to compare with my TTS Castle - I have third Castle which might soon get a sound chip.
The shunters to compare diesel and steam shunters under DCC. Later a similar pair will get sound chips, again for comparison.
The panier is also non DCC ready, so I get a view of hard wired against socketed chips.

So tomorrow, I will get a view on setting up loco addresses, and also see how the above locos run on my test track.
I will post my findings later in the week.

My 56xx is not ready yet, so it will be another 10 days before I have chance to collect it.

Best regards
Paul

Tallpaul70
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Re: My DCC Journey

#12

Post by Tallpaul70 » Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:27 pm

I thought I would share some points raised when I posted the above on another forum:-

I was asked if the Castles were of the same configuration to which I replied:-

The two Castles are not of the same Hornby variant The TTS is a factory fitted one uses the 2010 version of the body, but I think was announced last year(?), whereas the Zimo fitted is the 2005 Hornby Collectors club version, which I think has an earlier body, but the chassis/ motor etc. may be the same as from 2005 they were DCC ready.
Perhaps any Hornby experts reading this can enlighten us?
and their relative running qualities were queried, to which I replied:-
Only having a 6ft test track at present it is a little difficult to compare the running characteristics!

I was also asked if the pannier was of the type that had a sprung middle axle as the questioner thought them superior to more recent chassis variant:-
I said:-
Reference the pannier, it is a 32-212 again from 2005, and appears to have a sprung centre axle.

It was suggested that the Hornby 08 with 5 pole motor and flywheel was a very good slow running mechanism, with which I concurred, saying:-
The Hornby 08 does seem to run very slowly, very well!

Hope the above is useful?

Best regards
Paul

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Re: My DCC Journey

#13

Post by Mike Parkes » Wed Mar 20, 2019 10:44 pm

The 2005 Castle would be the old 1979 Airfix body on a Dapol originated loco chassis dating from 1985 (the AIrfix ones were tender driven) that Hornby acquired the tooling of in 1996. That model was made DCC ready in 2005.
Hornby introduced a completely new tooling in 2010 for the Castle.
The 2005 model is shown on this service sheet https://www.hornby.com/uk-en/serviceshe ... oad/id/67/
while the 2010 model has this service sheet https://www.hornby.com/uk-en/serviceshe ... ad/id/152/
and which shows them to be completely different.

Tallpaul70
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Re: My DCC Journey

#14

Post by Tallpaul70 » Thu Mar 21, 2019 3:50 pm

Thanks to Mike for his information on Hornby Castles.

I have completed the readdressing of the three locos recently chipped, and am pleased to say it was not difficult. They all work fine.

I then got overconfident and decided to try pairing the two shunters in what the NCE manual calls a consist. This was not difficult, but the problem I have is that I cant work out and the manual doesn't help on how to stop the locos working in a consist and return them to working against their individual addresses.

When I call up the individual addresses they just don't move?

Any help on this would be appreciated?

Best regards
Paul

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Brian
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Re: My DCC Journey

#15

Post by Brian » Thu Mar 21, 2019 7:34 pm

Tallpaul70 wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 3:50 pm
<Snip>
I then got overconfident and decided to try pairing the two shunters in what the NCE manual calls a consist. This was not difficult, but the problem I have is that I cant work out and the manual doesn't help on how to stop the locos working in a consist and return them to working against their individual addresses.

When I call up the individual addresses they just don't move?

Any help on this would be appreciated?

Best regards
Paul
They won't move as individual locos, you have assignment a Consist address to them, so they both move together.
You need to Dissolve or Clear the consist. See page 30 or page 32 of the PowerCab manual depending on what type of Consist you have set up for the two locos... https://www.dccconcepts.com/manual/nce- ... b-handset/

'Consist' is the US term for what the UK calls 'Double Heading'
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Chris
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Re: My DCC Journey

#16

Post by Chris » Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:08 am

Tallpaul70 wrote:
Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:27 pm
I was asked if the Castles were of the same configuration to which I replied:-

The two Castles are not of the same Hornby variant The TTS is a factory fitted one uses the 2010 version of the body, but I think was announced last year(?), whereas the Zimo fitted is the 2005 Hornby Collectors club version, which I think has an earlier body, but the chassis/ motor etc. may be the same as from 2005 they were DCC ready.

It was suggested that the Hornby 08 with 5 pole motor and flywheel was a very good slow running mechanism, with which I concurred, saying:-
The Hornby 08 does seem to run very slowly, very well!

Best regards
Paul
With regards to configuration with DCC there can be another area to consider that is the CV settings (CV = Configuration variable) these are depending on the decoder a substainal list of changes that can be made to the program within the decoder and in turns affects how a chip will respond to the throtle control.
So although the two castles are slightly different physically it should be possible to tweek settings to create near identical running, personally Ive changed some of the hornby defaults to provide quicker deceleration after a couple of near miss incidents

As for the 08, i've a bachman non DCC ready that i chiped with a basic hornby decoder and it runs very smoothly at slow speeds, as you can see if you wish: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IUDQzjSmhw

For points one option is to use accessory decoders that allow manual pushbuttons to be wired in as well like those from DCC Concepts, this would allow a mimic board to be created with switches and lights and allow DCC control to be used along side or developed later

Tallpaul70
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Re: My DCC Journey

#17

Post by Tallpaul70 » Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:59 am

Re Brian's contribution yesterday:-

The manual is not clear in its description of a "Consist".
I am glad that it is a feature I will not want to use often. It would be rather annoying if you wanted to use it all the time but every time you want to double head or bank a train you had to set up a consist!
I had expected that a consist would be an alternative to single running and you could set it up then call it up or call the engines up singly as the need arose.

On the subject of altering CVs, that is the next adjustment I will be trying!

Best regards
Paul

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Brian
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Re: My DCC Journey

#18

Post by Brian » Fri Mar 22, 2019 12:51 pm

Hi

You have already, perhaps unwittingly, altered a CV! The address number set for all new decoders is 03 and normally this is moved to whatever the owner wishes. This is CV1. :)

For a simple beginning in CV settings and without causing too much of a problem, the two I would suggest you try next are CV3 and CV4 These cause the loco to become slower in accelerating to whatever new speed is set for it, or slower to come to a stop from the current speed.
CV3 is acceleration rate while CV4 is deceleration rate.
I would suggest you play with CV3 for a start as this will show how the loco takes longer to reach the faster speed setting for each adjustment to CV3 value. For no Acceleration CV3 will be either 0 (zero) or at 1. Increase this by units of 10 at a time will show how this slows the loco from start more with each increase in setting. CV4 could cause accidents if its value is set to high, as you turn off the speed to zero but the loco still keeps moving until it eventually slows to a stop.

You need to remember the NCE manual is written for USA owners and will (like many other DCC Systems too) use US terminology.
This item may help you understand the various types of consists available. https://dccwiki.com/MU_consisting
Plus a watch of this NCE video (Rather jumpy though!) ... https://ncedcc.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/art ... o-Consist-
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Tallpaul70
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Re: My DCC Journey

#19

Post by Tallpaul70 » Fri Mar 22, 2019 2:33 pm

Brian,
Thanks for the info.

While the article on consisting is clearly comprehensive it is too techy for my current level of understanding of the NCE as I have only had the NCE a week. I felt I needed explanations that related it to a real UK layout context!

So I have decided to put consisting on the back burner for now. It is not an urgent requirement. it seemed easy to get the system to do what I needed in this type of operation. However, I was wrong, so I might look at CV3 and 4 next!

Best regards
Paul

Chris
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Re: My DCC Journey

#20

Post by Chris » Fri Mar 22, 2019 3:57 pm

Other CV's that are worth playing with, are for the speed curve commonly 2, 5 & 6
assuming the default values top speed is going to be what the top speed the loco can achieve, however most models can excede the speed that you would ever want them to go, by reducing the top speed CV5 you then have the ability to limit the maximum. This also provides greater control as instead of only driving a shunter by turning the throttle halfway for full speed, you regain the full range of the control. This can be really useful for allowig fine slow speed control.
look at the Zimo manual and it will explain it better

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